Learning to Fight - Conor vs Max - Episode 29

Learning to Fight Podcast — Conversations in Combat Skill

After a year-long hiatus, the Primal MMA Coaching Podcast is back—Rebranded, and refocused as the Learning to Fight Podcast: Conversations in Combat Skill.

Your hosts are:

Adam Singer — Co-owner and head coach at SBG Athens, BJJ black belt, long-time MMA coach, with years of developing novice to elite level fighters. Student of Matt Thornton and SBG's philosophy of 'aliveness'.
Scott Sievewright — Co-Owner at Primal MKE, MMA skills coach and obsessive student of how humans learn to move and fight. 

Together, we dive deep into the art and science of coaching, training, and skill development in combat sports.
 Expect honest conversations about MMA, striking, grappling, practice design, contemporary research, traditional approaches, ecological dynamics, and the messy realities of learning under pressure.

No gurus. No dogma. Just two coaches trying to understand fighting a little better each week.

Same curiosity. New lens.
Learn how to learn.
Find your own style.
Thrive on the mats—and in the cage.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:07

So I was hesitant to do this, and um our friend, our mentor, Sean Miska was the first one to encourage us to do this. He's been doing it, um and he's been definitely approaching us from a very ecological perspective, and I appreciate that. Um but I think we we took his advice and gave it a shot, right?

SPEAKER_02 0:29

On on talking about the fight.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Yeah. Give him a shout out. Give him a shout out, Scott.

SPEAKER_02 0:37

Yeah, I'm um I'm the movement Miyagi, big MMA geek. Um worth a follow-on X and whatnot. He he he really gets into the Sean's big things of formal life, right? Not necessarily just the the the the skills in the cage, the lead up, the you know, the the the personal circumstances, the the historical, the character of the fighter. So it's uh it's interesting.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

Sean, I hope you watch this and enjoy it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01

Yeah. And I need to take some more of Sean's money because i i I think he's uh he's got a good eye for skill in sports, but he's a shitty, shitty gambler, especially when it comes to me. So I'll be curious. I need to I think I think Sean's Sean's leaning towards Max too, right? I think you can get in a bet on Connor. I think he's a sucker for Connor. Is he a wee bit of a Connor fanboy? I think you can take some of his money. All right, yeah, I'll take it. I'll take it happily. Alright, Rory's coming on here shortly. We'll discuss our uh Max versus uh Connor predictions. Let's go. Got a quick conversation. Rory Singer, Adam Singer, let's get this circle jerk going. We're talking Max versus Connor. A little quick episode. I must admit I'm at a disadvantage here. I haven't watched too much of the Count 924, but when I listen to Connor speak, oh, I start to believe. I start to believe it every fucking time.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

So if he wins, we'll call this we'll call the post hoc episode the power of self-delusion and cocaine.

SPEAKER_02 1:55

There we go.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

So I think we can we can do all the we can talk about how long it's been and and things like that. But I we are an ecological approach podcast. So let me pose a question to both of you. What is ring rust and is it real?

SPEAKER_00 2:16

Is ring rust what is it and is it real? Uh I mean, I don't know what it is. It's the idea that if you've taken too much time from actually competing, that you will in a sense have forgotten how to compete. Uh is it real? I have to imagine that if we say we get better at competing by competing, and I think, I mean, I know I believe that on a personal level, it's anecdotal, but uh you you you don't get better at the thing you're doing while you're competing at it. You do that in the room, then then the opposite could likely also hold true. If you haven't done it in five years, you might not be as good as it at it as you were when you were really getting after it. And then you got a lot older and didn't really take care of yourself the way you should have been the entire time. I will take put a pin in that for a second. We'll come back to that. Scotty?

SPEAKER_01 3:01

How about from an ecological perspective? What is ring rust? What are we actually talking about?

SPEAKER_02 3:05

Okay, well, let's uh to narrow that right away. I think there's probably a uh a shallowing of these deep attractor wells from a dynamical systems perspective. So they're still there. Um, but there might be kind of a a shallowing just due to not being, you know, not experiencing these dynamics over time. Um I think with Connor too, he's talking in big game. If you've noticed, there's a lot more talk about his faith in God and whatnot, which I think can probably be extremely powerful for any athlete getting in a cage, right? Um I'm curious though, the the life that he's living right now, if he gets to that point, we've seen Connor break before. I mean as far as athletes and mental fortitude, he's he's up there with some of the greatest. But we've we have seen him break. And I'm just wondering if the lifestyle that he's living and all the the the privilege and the the of it that he has in his life right now, if that breaking point shifts. So is he willing in his life and his health and his opportunity and all the potential he's got to live this rock star life? How how far is he able to go into deep waters and not know sneaking?

SPEAKER_00 4:09

How much do you want? How much do you want it? Like what part of you how much are you willing to leave in the cage? Like that was the thing about Forrest. He was gonna live or die on his shield. You just knew regardless what the fight was. He was going in it and he had no self-preservation mode. He needed this money. That's how he lived. Connor doesn't need anything unless he has spent it all for this league.

SPEAKER_01 4:31

No, he needs he needs something. My friend was going to follow validation. Right. Exactly. So he does need something because he needs to athletes don't ride off into the sunset usually. They are told by the sport it's over. And so I think that it's it is about a validation because he is probably now questioning what he was, what he is, what he used to be. You know, he it is very easy to say he is a has been. But he would not say that. When you listen to him, he would not believe that. And I think he needs to prove that to himself, maybe. And it's funny you mentioned a religion because he seemed to have just like when we were talking about baseball players, they have to either be highly delusional or highly religious, and we can argue if those are the same things or not. He seems to have replaced one delusion with another.

SPEAKER_02 5:24

Um so a tr a tractor against me, but there's there's when I when I listen to this Connor talk, just as the like the whether it's manufactured or whatever, the the the confidence and the conviction that he has, it's admirable.

SPEAKER_01 5:39

Is that is it real confidence? I don't even know what real confidence means.

SPEAKER_02 5:43

So I'm unclear, it's unclear to me, but like this is it always aside. When Connor talks like this and the way he approaches the game and dedication and the critical thought and a curiosity, I've always I've always appreciated Darren Connor. It was all the other antics, and you know, like I said, I've I've I've I grew up in Scotland. There's there's there was a Connor McGregor in every pub. Like, granted, they couldn't fight like him. He's a special individual, but um when he gets was could be. It's still there's a question mark this weekend. And um that's when when Connor's talking like that and preparing like that and taking it seriously and it's about fighting, that's when I that's when I can see the appeal.

SPEAKER_00 6:17

How do we know how he's preparing? That's what I was gonna ask. And the talk is always the talk has never changed. Like we we we were privy to some information back in other in other times, the talk never changed, even if some of the information that we had was stating like, he's really not been doing what he's supposed to be doing. That being said, so you see on the outside, it's always the same. He's always that braggadocious, he's always that confident. Doesn't take him long after a loss to just immediately get back on and be like, hey, you know, blah, blah, blah. I mean, it's always so how do you know if he's training hard? How do you know if he's doing what he's supposed to be doing? How long has he even been doing it? We talked about this with other aspects, like dudes doing all the drugs to go run the races and swim the swims, and there was like one extra world record set. Like, you got to be doing a thing for a long time to continue to either stay or improve. And if you're not doing a thing for a long time, you have backed up a little bit. You haven't seen punches or kicks or elbows or wrestled or grappled, then how long does it take to get you to a place where Max Colloway, who's been fighting, continues to get in a cage and get after it, win or lose. But uh, you know, he's been in it. There's got to be a benefit to having not taken all these times off that Connor's taken off over the years.

SPEAKER_02 7:23

And I I guess it keeps it max too, is just like it's obviously going to be a mega payday. Um, while Connor's being like on his hiatus, Max is I know he talks about you know sparring hard and stuff, but he's been in some wars in these last five years.

SPEAKER_01 7:37

There's definitely reality there. There is, and they are both, you know, you could argue that at what is max is 34. Right. So I'm sorry, what work? Connor's 38, is that right? Did I get that? Connor's 37. Okay. 37. Oh, he turns 38 on the 14th. So by all accounts, he's 38. Um Max Max has really only lost, though, to the best of the best, right? He lost to Oliveira. That was a wrestling match. He beat Poirier, who was a former champion. He lost to Ila in the third round. Before that, he knocked out Gecchi. And then he's lost to he lost to Volkanovski twice. So he's lost to the best of the best. For sure. He is probably not at his peak anymore either. He has been in those wars. He has a lot of mileage and the age. Um but you know, Connor, the the question is you can I think Rory, that's what you're saying, you don't get better when you're out of the sport. He he had that horrendous leg break, which means he was probably out for at least a year. And then when did he start taking this return seriously?

SPEAKER_02 8:48

He's also in a very different body. Like physically. I think there's probably going to be uh initial physical advantage. I mean, Connor just looks like a unit right now, right? Right. Um Max's first dance at 170, is it? Is it his I think it is, yeah. I don't think he's fought at 70 before.

SPEAKER_01 9:06

Yeah, it's two, it's two up for where he usually fights.

SPEAKER_02 9:09

Right. I'm curious what Connor's walking at at the moment.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

Uh yeah, it looks like I mean I assume he's still cutting weight to 170. So and I don't have a gas tank. He's never had a gas tank. Right? Now, I saw Kavanaugh the other day talking about that when Connor first came up, he was very bouncy, very moving, in and out, I think. And he said that in recent fights, and I I guess he's talking about the second I guess he's talking about the two Poirier fights, that Connor was more measured, more stalking, more but that didn't work out so well versus Poirier, so it's hard to know, you know, if that's a if that's an evolution or or a necessity.

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Yeah, I see more of like there's a almost like a flat-footedness as crypt in his game from where he was initially. Just a beautiful, I mean he used to just fucking glide around that that cage.

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Yeah, he was definitely there's a period where he is one of the best movers in the sport. You know, he his eyes, his his ability to uh whatever nerdy, I don't want to use nerdy words, his his ability to see things and react to them. Uh the the video there the video I love is Alvarez just falling short by like this much and Kana remaining in position just to lay him out. You know, Aldo, Aldo lands the punch the same time Kana lands, but Kana lands it at the perfect distance, and Aldo doesn't.

SPEAKER_00 10:34

How much of that is based upon your ability? Not only maybe your eyes can still see things as you get a little older, you know, people still have good reaction times in their older age, so to say, or or but like how can you get the can you get the the offense off or the defense off or the counter off?

SPEAKER_01 10:49

You're you're dangerously close to separating things again, Rory.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

So so how but can you can even if you could see, I mean, I could see my students hitting me. So we talked about this before.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:59

I got I understand what you're trying to say. No, like I can see it. It's like you can see fights where a dude sees it when I slow it down, you see his eyes like he's like, oh, I I'm done. He wants to get out of the way. He's not. So I'm gonna get out of the way of all of it.

SPEAKER_02 11:12

If we talk about like uh and it's striking, right? Um these affordances that are uh emerging and decaying, you have to think, given the the bigger um the more weight he's carrying, so it's a heavier, it's it's a heavier body to move, that these affordances that that like that temporal quality, here we go, uh like how when they emerge, when they decay, is probably, if anything, being shortened, which puts a demand on him to be have to actually be able to organize even quicker.

SPEAKER_01 11:40

It's shortened or his landscape, for lack of a better, has changed. The affordance landscape that Connor at 145 and a beautiful mover was able to see is different than the landscape 170-pound. I'm not gonna say plotting, but stalking Connor is gonna be able to see. And he has to have a physical, his action capacities have to have diminished. Now, right. And and so have they diminished, how much have they diminished, and how quickly will they diminish further under fatigue is something we have no idea.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Um but and we're not we're not suggesting that like when you talk about the classes, he he's he's obviously got the best uh the strength and conditioning uh coaches and support in his so we're not saying he can't produce the same kind of maybe, but we're not we're not saying we're not suggesting that he can't produce incredible amounts of force and uh power, but can he can he do that in in the fight? Can he organize himself? Is it can he perceive and act at that high level now that he used to? Given it given the age, given uh whether it's ring rust or whatever, um I'm sure he's been spending this guess where the camp is, right? He's recalibrating to all the reads and whatnot. My main question with corner is uh he's gonna have to have training partners that are not just fucking Starstruck.

SPEAKER_01 12:59

Yeah, and I don't I'm not sure he has those training partners because also if you're his coach, and I think he's his coach, but let's say he has a coach, I could I could find in Georgia three or four 170 pounders that in a sparring session could light his ass up. And I think we all you could do the same thing, and it may even be in your gym, right? And so, and then the only way for Connor to maybe not get lit up is to turn these sparring matches into fights. And is Connor, is it good at his age and his experience and his mileage getting ready for this to put him into fights to affect his confidence? Like, or do you coddle him to the point that he will be even less ready, less calibrated, less whatever you want to call it? Right? Because if you want to knock the ring rust off, if you're a boxer and you want to knock the ring rust off, I know in boxing that means you're doing some hard rounds. You're bringing a guy in and doing some hard rounds. Do we think Connor took did that? He risked that, his coaching staff risked that injury, confidence, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_00 14:07

It's it's certainly, I think we would all agree it's the way that he should have gone about it, but maybe at his age, I don't know. But he even at his age, that's the way he sh he needed to, because otherwise there's no calibration happening. Otherwise, you have not really prepared yourself for this other athlete. You know, it'd be like all we did was bad work and hand pads. Like we know that that's not the thing. You need to spore. You need, you know, not all not all sparring cultures are healthy, so maybe he can't, maybe he, but he needed to, because you need to train fighty things to then get into a fight.

SPEAKER_02 14:41

And then where does that map onto our ideas of of sparring, like submaxable forces?

SPEAKER_01 14:47

Well, no, I think what we're arguing is uh and Royal, correct me if I'm wrong, I think what I'm arguing at least is because there was this gap, right? First off, he gets he breaks his leg, which means he doesn't train for a year. Then he's not training for any fight, so he's not focused, he's not intentional, he's not in the gym every day, twice a day. So what I'm saying is he had a short ramp up period. I think in our our respect, we're sparring every day. That's probably what Max is doing, but it's sub-maximal. But you're playing every day. It's like a basketball player out playing pickup every day. But when you're out for a long time and then you have this is it a six-month camp, is it an eight-week camp? We don't know what it is. I think that you probably need, at least at the start of that camp, some intensity. Because you don't want the first because I don't think that the first, I don't think you want to start to recalibrate to to whatever fight speed is after touching gloves with Max. Like I think you needed some, and maybe he did, we don't know, but I would bet against too much of that.

SPEAKER_02 15:52

I think this map's on uh, you know, the the the bigwigs in eco dynamics and whatnot, they're there's they're starting to soften this idea of skill acquisition, or they don't like the acquisition part because it implies that like once you learn to ride a bike, you can always ride a bike. And and there's a there's there's there's a there's a truthiness in that, right? Connor's slowly though going to regardless, even if he came off the couch, he's still gonna be incredible at doing fighting things. I agree. But was it was it enough? Um I would be again, this is all pure speculation. I would imagine Max is gonna at least be a bit cautious in the earlier part of the fight. Because regardless, Connor's got a tremendous amount of pop. Accuracy is probably still, there's probably still you know remnants of that there. I think Connor's, of course, and he's always been that fighter. He's gonna be extremely dangerous in the first round.

SPEAKER_00 16:39

Yeah, and he's strong, and he's big and he's strong, and he's probably gonna be able to, at least in the beginning, weather some more of that speed and maybe even some some of that power that uh Max is bringing, just because, I mean, he's getting he's stout, right? He's put on some weight, he's thickened up, he's lifted hard, I imagine. Uh, so not only do you have to be aware of his power, which he'll still have, I would imagine, unless he got extremely slow, then he won't be able to generate any. You're gonna you're not gonna want to stand and trade with him in that first round and take a chance. You might land, but you're not gonna land with the kind of power you need for that one-punch knockout, likely against Connor. Is uh hours the last thing to go, right?

SPEAKER_02 17:16

Right. Do you think there's a trade-off there too now that they're 170, that there's probably a uh a durability that they've that they're getting an advantage of? I think we see that with fighters when they're not cutting as much weight. There seems to be you know increased durability there, but that's probably the trade-off with the the quickness, right? Probably right.

SPEAKER_01 17:32

And like Forrest said, like, are you training in the body you're fighting in? So Max hasn't necessarily been training in that body if he's been, you know, if he comes in, if he's trying to bulk up. And Connor has been that heavy for a long time, so maybe that's a little bit of an advantage to Connor. Connor's probably done all his work at that weight for the last few years.

SPEAKER_02 17:52

Yeah, I'd be curious to I I wish the UFC would do that. Um let you know the weights of the fighters when they step in the cage. I think that'd just be an interesting stat to track over time. And I'm not sure. Do the UFC do that? Is there the odd way ends? I don't think so. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 18:06

I don't think there is.

SPEAKER_02 18:08

I think that's a stat I would be interested in.

SPEAKER_01 18:11

Yeah, I think we talked about that with Forrest. I thought he said it was coming at least as a um in a paper that they were gonna look at that. I think boxing does that, and I like that. I think it's important. Um maybe it affects betting, so maybe they have to be careful with that. Um you said something I just want to go back to for a second. You talked about sort of a strategy for Max, right? Which is probably don't get into an uh a firefight. A firefight within the first, you know, at least the first three minutes. I know you said one round, but I think historically, I think it's like three or four minutes is what you know an explosive guy has. And maybe, maybe Connor's smarter now. Maybe there is an experience where he knows that he has to be a little bit more measured. Max has only been finished one time. And maybe he knows that he needs to be a little bit more measured. But here's the here's the flip side. In a perfect world, Connor's easiest path to victory is just grappling.

unknown 19:10

Right?

SPEAKER_00 19:10

I mean laying on him, basically hugging him, clenching him, laying on him, maybe trying to tie him, or just put him on the ground grapple. I think he can out-grapple Max.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

I think he could out-grapple Max. I think he could take his back, I think he could choke him out. Okay. Um, I think he could, you know, when you take someone down and they're in the process of trying to stand up, there are all kinds of opportunities, and Connor is a much better grappler than people have ever given him credit for. He was looking good against Khabib until he got gassed. He was, and if you're gonna argue, his coach, if nothing else, is a phenomenal grappler and grappling coach. JK is. And so when it comes to guillotines, rare naked chokes, back takes and things, Connor is probably, you know, a higher, a high level. Max has not shown a great ability to grapple.

SPEAKER_02 19:50

Um can we just go back to this? Can we just go back to this weight thing quickly and plays? Perhaps if we knew, if if we saw, if we saw data over time, that what the fighters are actually fighting at when they walk in the cage, that could have a meaningful effect on how fighters, what weight fighters choose to fight at. If there was if you know, if if the data came out and said there, and I think we kind of we already know this, right? That there's probably this optimal zone and it's different for everyone. How much weight can you cut before you're it's deleted a state of performance? I think by weighing the fighters in before they go in the cage and tracking that over time, I think you'd start to see some like people would use that data, and you think you'd start to see most likely fighters come up. Now, whether they come up and if they come up a weight class and then they end up walking around a weight class higher, then nothing's really changed there. But I'm I'm I'm really interested in that number.

SPEAKER_01 20:38

I think that number, I think that number exists, and I think Forrest alluded to it without talking about the paper, um, and with a caveat about how difficult it is to really get these accurate numbers. But I think Forrest was telling us that it was 10%.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

10% that's 170 pounder, like if they're walking in the cage at like 186, 187.

SPEAKER_01 21:01

Right. So basically what he I think what he was alluding to is and I don't know if he meant that you walk around all year at 10%, but if you can cut that 10% the last week, then that's what you come into the cage at. And so if you walk into the the UFC weighs you on Tuesday, so they have they have 30 years of data on Tuesday weigh-ins because they've done that to make sure they aren't going to lose a fight. So if you step on a scale Tuesday morning, you've already started your weight cut. So let's say you step on a scale Tuesday morning, you're 185. If the rest of that week is just a weight cut, then you're you should expect to go into the cage around 185. And so I would like to see if guys are able to if guys can push that and and what that if that's a successful strategy or not a successful strategy. Um I think it is a measure of how well people cut weight and time their weight cuts. Stuff. So I think there'll be a tremendous amount of value in that data like you do. But I think what Forest was telling us is that 10% number has been validated in some sense.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

I'm the first to admit I'm not an SEC guy, but I I wear this whoop, right? And I'm starting to find that when I get on a green day, I do feel good that day. I feel good on the mats. I wake up and it's green, HRV is high, it's got good sleep and whatnot. Um uh I mean there must be a tremendous amount of pressure and whatnot just the night before, and that's what these champs have to get through, right? And that's where they probably get better over time. You know, how did they sleep the night before? The level of anxiety, you know, I'd be curious to see if they're waking up in the green or the red. Again, I'm I'm speaking about a superficial level, but there's something there.

SPEAKER_01 22:43

So it it's funny, it's funny. I I was here, I was listening to um a couple guys talk who were uh special operations guys, and they were talking about these these bracelets, these things like that. And they and the point they were making was well, let's say you wake up Saturday morning and you're in a red and you're you have to go on a mission. Well, then you go on a mission, and you're still expected to perform, and usually you still perform the way you would have, whether it was green or not.

SPEAKER_02 23:10

So is that green? Does that me seeing it as green in the morning? Is that just having an effect on me to say I'm I'm ready to go today? So I go to training, I go and train with this perception that I'm good to go.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

Confident. Right. So I think the green and red are more uh are more valuable for trending matched with the other things you're doing. I think in isolation they don't mean much. But I think you see trends, and if you could match them with other data like sleep, like nutrition, like weight, whatever it is, I think maybe even get a picture that can help you adjust before. But if you wake up, if Max wakes up red Saturday morning, does it just call off the fight? Or if he loses a fight, is he like, listen, I just woke up at red this morning?

SPEAKER_00 23:57

So I knew I was fucked.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

I'm out.

SPEAKER_00 24:01

Peace.

SPEAKER_01 24:02

Okay, I'm saying Max is a good one. I'm out. I'm gonna tell you. I'm gonna tell you who wants Connor to win. I'm gonna tell you who wants Connor to win so badly. Dana White. And Justin Gagey.

SPEAKER_00 24:16

Yeah, it'll make uh it'll it'll be another level. They haven't uh they haven't fought yet, have they either? No. So it's not a number, it's not a two, it's not, you know, it's not a sequel, it's uh and it would I would imagine it would have to be it would have to be for the title, right? Because you just give it a straight in and go and just go straight into a title fight, one fight after five years, straight into a title fight. For real. And uh if it got done within the next couple months after this fight, if that's why it went down, then that I can't see how that wouldn't be one of the biggest, one of the biggest.

SPEAKER_02 24:46

And it's gonna be a title fight unless it's at 55, though.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

No, it has to be at 55. And then then there's a question, right? How does Connor can Connor get to 55?

SPEAKER_02 24:56

Change his body again, right? There's a lot of I mean the density on on the kid now.

SPEAKER_01 25:01

And that was a huge downfall for Roy Jones Jr. Is he bulked up and then he cut back down. And when he cut back down, he left something out there. He lost something. I I am when I look at this fight, I am fascinated by the changes in physical or actual capacities, physical ability that we know exist after 30 years old, after 35 years old. Um, I'm really interested to see how that shows up Saturday night. I looked, I tried to look for anything similar to this, and the best I could do was Ali took off three and a half years. But he started that three and a half years at 29 in his prime. And when he came back, he was never the same. He was still a champion, he still won a belt again, but he was never the same Ali. And Connor took that time off, we could argue, at a point where he was He wasn't in jail reading the Quran. No, he was not. He broke his leg and he was one in three. So over the last eight years, he's one in three. And so there's a difference between maybe taking off time. Football, it happens to football players, they'll miss a year because they blow out their ACL in their prime. They come back a lot of times to the same exact level. So what but so let's if we wrap this up, let's prognize, let's make our predictions. Why are you back? Where were you? What are you shitting?

SPEAKER_00 26:33

I I don't my my uh signal in this room is a little bit so we're gonna say it was unstable, so sometimes just turning off the camera takes less computer stuff. You're unstable. I'm at the fucking beach, homie. Beach here don't care. All right, let's go. Make a prediction. Rory, Max bye. Uh I'm gonna have to say by KO. Ooh. Because at some point can't move anymore. He's just uh I'm so old and heavy. Alright, Max by KO, when fourth round.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

Alright, Scotty? I'm gonna come a little bit earlier. And uh with a caveat that if Connor manages to tag him in the first, I think Connor has an absolute potential to knock him out. I don't I think Max is gonna be too crafty, too smart, uh too well read to get caught. Uh, but that I'll leave as a caveat. I think I'm gonna go for uh TKO. Knock the fuck out at TKO. Of course, that's probably bad. I think he's gonna break Connor in his second or third. Pure speculation.

SPEAKER_00 27:32

TKO, fourth round. Maybe not a knockout, like a clean butt just finishes him off. Fourth round, TKO.

SPEAKER_01 27:39

I'm gonna answer this as a degenerate gambler since I asked my guys last night, put put your money on Connor since he's the underdog. Put your money on Connor. So you're wearing a shirt. Is this how we're gonna get the last couple years paid? Yeah, I'm gonna put all of Sydney's college money on Connor McGregor to win, baby. I don't think he'll go off as a huge underdog, though, because a lot of money's going on him. So I don't know if it'll pay for the last two years, but maybe one year.

SPEAKER_02 28:04

And one more time, kudos. I mean, I haven't watched a great deal of it, but kudos to the UFC marketing team. They really do a good job of pulling you in and thinking it's gonna be super competitive and it can go either way. They do an extremely good job of that.

SPEAKER_01 28:15

Well, my next door neighbor is an MMA fan, but really is a Connor McGregor fan. And I bet in his head, he doesn't, he has no idea that Connor was one and three. He has no, like he knows this, but it doesn't matter. If Connor's fighting, it is a huge fight, and he's going to watch it. He's gonna have friends over, and it's an event. And I think the the I don't know if we could say that about any other fighter in the UFC. I don't even know if we could say that about anyone in boxing right now.

SPEAKER_02 28:46

Let's talk quickly about the the the stances here. What do you what do you what do you see, Matt? Because Max can clearly you know bat both ways. Um what would Barry say? There there was one good expression of that. I think he was doing well until he wasn't. Chad Mendez, when he fought Connor, was doing a terrific job of circling away from the power. And as he started to fatigue early on and got a little bit flustered, then he started going to the uh Connor's uh right, uh, or vice versa, whoever. He was going away from the power, and that's when he was getting tagged. I think if Max gets his kind of dancing shoes on for the first round, stays away from these nukes, then I think I think their chances of Rory and I's predictions coming true are uh increase significantly.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

But yeah, I wish Max had a I wish Max had a little bit of a more sophisticated kicking game. Um because I think that there's a weakness of Connor, especially if he's more of a stocky plotter. He's never shown the ability and uh to really defend kicks, and I think if he could get if you could hit him in the calf a couple times, you could really slow him down. I wish Max had any threat of a takedown, because then you could really make Connor one-dimensional, uh, much like you know uh Justin did versus Ilia. But I think that this is going to be a mostly a uh Connor's gonna throw a lot of kicks, it's mostly gonna be a kickboxing match.

SPEAKER_02 30:08

Yeah, and um, you know, it doesn't necessarily take power. If we look at the Diaz fights, you know, he just chipped away, showed a tremendous amount of durability, took all the big shots, and just kept coming back because it's quite clear that um Diaz isn't a power puncher, right? Just volume, just volume. And I think that that's that kind of maps on a little bit more to Max's style. All right, so simply so simply put, we are saying early power versus longer volume.

SPEAKER_00 30:37

That's that's what I'm versus yeah, early power versus late volume, because Max has the gas tank. I don't think Connor's got the gas. He's never shown it. I don't see how you get it at nearly 38 and having not been who you needed to be if you were gonna be a champion this whole time, you know, like just stop capacity.

SPEAKER_01 30:54

I ended up talking, I ended up talking to James about this yesterday. We were talking about sort of peaks and things, and if you want to extend your prime, if you want to extend your peak, you have to work harder. Now it's smarter, but harder. And I think we'd all agree that Connor's probably not done that. So I guess we'll see Saturday night.

SPEAKER_00 31:18

Let's see. We should get home in between four and five hours, depending on, but yeah, I'll be we'll be I'll be home, relax, and then head on over. Who's the cool man?

SPEAKER_01 31:28

Uh your boy Patty Pimlet versus Benoit Sandini.

SPEAKER_02 31:31

Oh, it is um Benoit. Okay. Uh it is Patty. Interesting. I so you're paying attention to the cards.

SPEAKER_01 31:39

So the best the fight that I'm I'm super excited about is uh Gable Stevenson. Are you are you familiar with him? Yes, the stud wrestler, right? I mean, stud. But it's funny because I don't think he wanted to do MMA. Like I I think if if it I think he wanted to play professional football, and I don't think that worked out, and he wanted to make a career out of international wrestling, that I don't think that worked out. And then I think he tried to WWE, and I don't think he had the personality for that. So he is such a he is such a monster that he's like, all right, I'll do MMA. And within like two year and a half, he's in the UFC.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

How do you um how do you compare and contrast um Stevenson? Because I'm I'm I'm not I'm not by no means I haven't actually watched um Stevenson fight. It's Stevenson, right?

unknown 32:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:26

Yeah. Um how do you map on his kind of style and where he's come from and that like to DC? Is there similarities there?

SPEAKER_01 32:32

Um I think DC, well, it's hard to say because the DC that I'm thinking of is a is a the DC later in his career when he was a very well-rounded guy. Um I think DC wasn't I think Gable is a better athlete and a but it's a really good question that I have to think about.

unknown 32:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Um DC was a very good fighter. But again, I don't remember DC in his first few fights.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

I just remember him coming through this tear through his belly tour, right? Um, and knocking motherfuckers out here, there and everywhere.

SPEAKER_01 33:10

And Stevenson has has that kind of Stevenson in one of his first fights hit a guy. He he had this explosive double-leg slam knockout that just all happened like unbelievably fast. Like, how is he that explosive? And so I think what Gable has that DC never had is the ability to double leg other heavyweights. And I don't think that was never DC's game. DC was more of a clinch guy, lifting, slamming. Gable can get under heavyweights and take them down. And I think that gives him a very, I think that puts him at a higher level early in his career than if he was not capable of doing that, if that makes sense. If he had to wade through striking and get into exchanges, then there's always a risk of getting knocked out as a heavyweight. But I think that he can draw out exchanges and just double egg people, and I think that that is a weapon at the heavyweight that is gonna be hard for people to deal with.

SPEAKER_02 34:10

So very good. Okay, we're keeping this one short. Yeah. That's all I have. That's it. Max, Max and three. Two or three for me. TKO. Four. Four. Underdog paying for college. All right. First round knock is Max. Oh, we are going to Max. Max is going to be a three for Max. Three for Max. We'll see you tomorrow. We've got Tobias coming on. Yep. Tell us off.